Subscribe

Forum

What can managers do to keep good people?

Welcome to the newly redesigned Science Careers Forum. Please bookmark this site now for future reference. If you've previously posted to the forum, your current username and password will remain the same in the new system. If you've never posted or are new to the forum, you will need to create a new account.

The new forum is designed with some features to improve the user experience. Upgrades include:
- easy-to-read, threaded discussions
- ability to follow discussions and receive notifications of updates
- private messaging to other SC Forum members
- fully searchable database of posts
- ability to quote in your response
- basic HTML formatting available

Moderator: Dave Jensen
Advisors:   Ana, PG, Rich Lemert, Dick Woodward, Dave Walker
Meet the Moderator/Advisors

What can managers do to keep good people?

Postby Dave Jensen » Mon May 21, 2018 10:30 am

We have another thread running, started by advisor PG, about career expectations and how many early-stage scientists decide to uproot themselves and go to a new employer as opposed to waiting for their career development to blossom in the company that employs them.

I feel like we need another thread -- one that focuses on what employers can do to keep good people?

Please -- if you have comments here, put them up! What is it that you would like your boss to do that would enable the company to keep you longer (and keep you from reviewing job ads with your morning coffee)?

Dave
"Failure is a bruise -- not a tattoo." -- Jon Sinclair
User avatar
Dave Jensen
Site Moderator
 
Posts: 7938
Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2012 11:28 pm

Re: What can managers do to keep good people?

Postby D.X. » Mon May 21, 2018 11:42 am

Hi Dave,

As a first start, it's good for the employer to have a routine conversation with good people (talent) about not only their contineud performance but also their development. This includes a conversation about next steps and, few good bosses do this, but a road-map on how to get there. And the time frame should be reasoable.

The issue with with good talent is that, if they are good, they'll naturally keep their ears to the ground for external opportunies too or get head-hunted.

Today, i think the timeframe when talent becomes good talent (provided they are performers) is about 2 to 3 years in the job, figure the 1st year they're learning the organization and job, 2nd year they're delivering and 3rd year well the itch starts provided they've been high-performers. The issue with high performers is that once they get an "exceeds" on their IPD, well there's only one way to go after that (down), so they'll get itchy quickly and that's the point to start risk-mitigating fast if an employer wants to keep that employee. So the early that conversation is had, the quicker the road-map is placed the better chances it is to ratain that talent. Few bosses put milestones down as well, and that should be done.

I also think there should be proactive discussion about internal moves. Personally, when it comes to internal moves, it should be treated just like an external application in terms of talent management - the problem is there is too much process and politics involved in internal moves (i posted this on a thread if you remember which is in fact the blue-print hands-down) where one has to get endorsement from ones boss and the other and blah blah blah.

Once an employee sess and internal job and expreses interest that should be a signal to treat that employee as the talent that they are and give feedback imeediately - because if they're looking at internal postions, you bet they're looking at external positions and well...lose the talent..better to keep good talent you know that hire talent you don't know in my humble opinion. The problem is today folks not in the know, apply for internal jobs as external applicant would (put the CV in ta data-base, no discussion with the boss apriori, and well the um..fecal-storm begings, which I note shouldn't be the case but it is).

And i think manageres need to know when "training" is not enough. When compensation increase is not enough and the only other option is promotion or move to next positon. Employers will spend 8,000 K USD on a business-class ticket for a 3,000 K USD training course to try to keep an employee happy, they may even give you a measely "excellence award" or "special bonus" (aka a measly amount of bucks in your pocket to "keep you happy". But promotion and internal move...harder and harder to come by, many bosses just don't want to deal with it (even if its within line-promotion, say Manager to Sr. Manager.).

so I think employers need to really take a hard look in the mirror - look at that talent and understand really quick when training and additional compensation is not going to cut it.

Another item that works as well but limited in time is ensure that talent is empowered. A sense of indepedent responsiblity is important as well...known that too has an expiration date.

In PG's thread some one noted on the 2 to 3 year horizon.

And my final point, on the employer side, we're use to talent turn over. Every week you read so and so left the company and then a couple months later, annoncement of the new replacement and then another one leaves, and so and so and so it goes, we're just use to it..cue Queen's "Another one bites the dust".

Best,

DX
D.X.
 
Posts: 1210
Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2012 11:29 pm

Re: What can managers do to keep good people?

Postby ATF » Tue May 22, 2018 10:12 am

My personal feelings are that higher turnover is a phenomenon that is largely out of the hands of managers at companies. Of course you want to make employees happy, have a good working environment etc., but the reality is in pharma that layoffs are ubiquitous and therefore it makes little sense on the employee side to stay loyal to companies who will not appreciate or value that loyalty down the line. If there is no job security or loyalty from a company, there is no point in being loyal yourself...
ATF
 
Posts: 48
Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2012 11:48 pm

Re: What can managers do to keep good people?

Postby D.X. » Tue May 22, 2018 10:48 am

ATF wrote:My personal feelings are that higher turnover is a phenomenon that is largely out of the hands of managers at companies. Of course you want to make employees happy, have a good working environment etc., but the reality is in pharma that layoffs are ubiquitous and therefore it makes little sense on the employee side to stay loyal to companies who will not appreciate or value that loyalty down the line. If there is no job security or loyalty from a company, there is no point in being loyal yourself...


yeah but that's a different issue linked to consolidation and re-organization efforts, either triggered by M&A or shift in corporate strategy, the latter usually linked to new leadership and organzational structure in an effort to more efficient meet new corporate objectives and ambitions. That's a different story - here what we're talking about is assuming the status re-organzational change.

In the case you raise up that's a different discussion that has been hashed out here on other threads. I do see your point on job secruity and loyality but this more more about folks being "entrepreneural" with thier careers and leveraging our "new world order" to advance careers more closely linked to employee view of readiness and time-horizon vs. that of the current employer or employment situation.

Best,

DX
D.X.
 
Posts: 1210
Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2012 11:29 pm

Re: What can managers do to keep good people?

Postby PG » Tue May 22, 2018 10:59 am

I think that ATF has a Point in that companies that goes through multiple reorganizations and that frequently lays of people due to causes that you as an individual or your manager cant influence will have a harder time keeping their staff turnover low. If you dont know if you have a job with your current Company a year from now whatever you do it will impact how you Think about career development.

In addition to having a good work environment you need to be able to show your staff that they have a good chance of developing their careers within the Company or the Group of companies. Obviously company size is going to impact the possibility that exists to do this and also geographical location since it might not be realistic to move internationally for all types of positions. To do this you need to have regular meetings with your staff to discuss career develpoment and their career goals and you also need to show that it is realistic to meet those goals within your organization. You also need to show that the Company is recruiting internally for the majority or at least a large part of more advanced positions thereby showing that if you want to have one of these senior positions within this Company the best path to get there is by moving internally rather than externally.
PG
 
Posts: 1018
Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2012 11:28 pm

Re: What can managers do to keep good people?

Postby Dave Jensen » Tue May 22, 2018 12:42 pm

ATF wrote:My personal feelings are that higher turnover is a phenomenon that is largely out of the hands of managers at companies. Of course you want to make employees happy, have a good working environment etc., but the reality is in pharma that layoffs are ubiquitous and therefore it makes little sense on the employee side to stay loyal to companies who will not appreciate or value that loyalty down the line. If there is no job security or loyalty from a company, there is no point in being loyal yourself...


Thats a fairly negative and grim assessment. I would hate to go to work everyday and have that attitude weighing me down.

I would think that the lack of promotional opportunities then becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy because people can detect this? Have you considered that someone with a sunny "I'll do whatever it takes to help my company" attitude might end up being then in the position to get the opportunity to move up when it comes?

Dave
"Failure is a bruise -- not a tattoo." -- Jon Sinclair
User avatar
Dave Jensen
Site Moderator
 
Posts: 7938
Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2012 11:28 pm

Re: What can managers do to keep good people?

Postby E.K.L. » Tue May 22, 2018 3:59 pm

D.X. wrote:So the early that conversation is had, the quicker the road-map is placed the better chances it is to ratain that talent. Few bosses put milestones down as well, and that should be done.


I second that. It was, in fact, the reason for my recent move. My manager just wasn't (midly speaking) very good at discussing any long term commitments, opportunities or milestones when it came to career advancement. After a few months of such back & forth talking I've received a better external offer and that was it.

And to be honest, if you cannot discuss any long-term engagements, then it does feel like you are a temporary hire anyway.
E.K.L.
 
Posts: 58
Joined: Sun Mar 04, 2012 1:53 am


Return to Science Careers Forum

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: David Lathbury and 14 guests